Ep. 168 The Problems With the Green New Deal

18 December 2018     |     Tom Woods     |     12

Newly elected member of Congress Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez has been calling for a “Green New Deal,” which she says will at once confront the dangers of climate change and also provide good jobs at living wages and overturn racial and gender injustices. We are unconvinced.

Plan Discussed

A Green New Deal

Book Mentioned

The Politically Incorrect Guide to the Great Depression and the New Deal, by Bob Murphy; click here to get the audiobook version for free.

Related Links

The Game-Changing Promise of a Green New Deal,” by Naomi Klein
It’s Time to Go Nuclear in the Fight Against Climate Change,” by Eric Holthaus

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  • NoMoreFed

    This was a good episode of Contra Ocasio-Cortez.

  • Roger Barris

    Tom and Bob:

    Here is my earlier write up on this proposal, which has been endorsed by my Democratic opponent for the US House, Joe Neguse. You are absolutely right: if we are lucky, this is merely the most absurd proposal of all time. If we are unlucky, this would be the basis on which simpletons like Ocasio-Cortez would socialize our entire economy.

    (PS. When referring to Ocasio-Cortez, the proper forms of address are “Bolshevik Barbie” or “She Guevara.” She is a disgrace to the study of economics (which, fortunately, was only her minor).)

    https://www.coloradopolitics.com/opinion/in-response-boulder-s-new-u-s-rep-hops-aboard/article_6dc925a6-f81f-11e8-8729-835c10ba0148.html

  • Berttalk

    It is difficult to know where to start in response to this podcast. But the accusation that the left hates capitalism seems a good place to start. What the left has a disdain for is not private enterprise which those on the right always want to imply. It is unfettered capitalism. This is a critical understanding the right wants to hide.
    While it is likely possible to find extremist on the left, just as it is easy to find extremist on the right who think a women can turn off getting pregnant when they are raped. Its safe to say the vast majority on the left are strong believers in private enterprise. Despite the loosely used term of socialist or socialism which has lost a clear meaning in discussions. If you doubt this to be true. Determine for your self whether the Countries in the European union are socialist or capitalist?
    The top .01% own as much as the bottom 90%. What the “Left” or what ever label you wish to assign to them. Believe is more equity in the system a more fair system can mitigate the poverty end of the equation.
    What they are saying and what this podcast wishes to debate is the idea that an economy that is in harmony with a healthy environment and that tackles the challenge of climate change can be prosperous as well.
    What those on the right believe is the only way to have a strong economy is to have unfettered access to dirty energy and exploitation of the environment. Hanging on to the myth that there is no consequences to such and economy and pollution and exploitation of the environment can go on unmitigated forever. While any regulation of either pollution or environmental exploitation will result in a disaster to the economy or massive poverty. They pretend to themselves that our environment is relatively clean and healthy currently so that is proof of their belief in unmitigated exploitation. Using total amnesia to ignore the fact that the only reason we have a reasonable environment in this country is because of the environmental movement that started in the 1960s and the laws environmentalist fought for that our economy some how survived and prospered under.
    What the right is fighting for under the guise of freedom is to allow for massive inequalities in the system while still retaining the promise of higher wealth for all. Despite the evidence that the ship has already risen to its highest point and the limitations of the environment, energy, resources will no longer provide the ability to achieve higher economic levels for any sustainable period of time. The simple fact is unfettered capitalist inequality does not work for a society as a whole. As we can see with so many area’s of poverty within our nation and a greater and greater percentage of the population existing in debt and on the edge of complete economic destitution.
    When pointing out the flaws in the grandiose promises of the “Green new Deal” one may wish to identify the false grandiose myths the right in clinging to as well.
    Perhaps instead of attacking the concepts with in the “Green new Deal” the right can accept the reality that our environment is important and that in order for future generations to have a healthy environment real hard choices need to be addressed. Nuclear could be part of the solution. However as we have seen in Japan and elsewhere it has serious concerns and failure of any nuclear plant can not be an acceptable consequence. Unless you are willing to have your children be the ones who are poisoned.

  • Matt Hartley

    I honestly don’t get the love for the new deal. It was a complete abject failure as an economic policy. I get why politicians would like it, the guy who implemented it got reelected until he died, but why on earth would everybody long for the economic policy that failed to get the country out of the great depression for an entire decade? The best they can do is “When they tried to do less new deal stuff in 1937, the economy went back down”, which is hardly the “the great depression was over in a matter of months” style turnaround you’d expect given the rhetoric.

    If my preferred political policies led to such bad results the one time it was famously implemented, I would never mention it, except to excuse how bad it did. but people who support new deal style policies talk about how great the new deal was in spite of the facts.

    • Tyler Folger

      This was always baffling to me too…..I’m pretty sure I got the same story about “FDR getting us out of the depression” when I was in grade school. And I remember just not knowing what the heck the teacher was talking about because I was just looking at the dates for the depression vs. FDR’s time in office, and not understanding where the teacher’s conclusion was coming from, because just superficially, it sure looked like FDR was making the depression worse and worse his entire time in office.

  • ProfessorBernardoDeLaPaz

    O-Cor says that capitalism hasn’t always been with us and that it won’t be with us forever. She’s right on one point and I fear on another. Capitalism HASN’T always been with us, but poverty and ignorance have. As (crudely and imperfectly) capitalism has advanced, poverty has abated. Leftists would cheerfully condemn the lot of us to extinction, as that is the only way to expunge humanity of free enterprise.

  • Icy Blast

    I think these two should talk about anything they want. Krugman is fizzling out. His narcissistic delusions can’t sustain his pointless, annoying career. Also, the Internet has gradually exposed his stupidity. Maybe they should rename this the Woods and Murphy Hour!

  • Icy Blast

    Bob finally said “nuclear” instead of “nucular”! He just keeps getting better.

  • Terry Hesticles

    Green New Deal is nothing more than Agenda 2030 wrapped up in a pretty little “progressive” bow.
    Couple this with the fact that Ocasio-Cortez is beating this drum from within the corporate Democrat party should be ringing alarm bells.

  • Right Ruminations

    Easy – Climate change is just a giant broken window.

  • PDG2

    The people pushing this green new deal nonsense have an intellectual aptitude on par with that of a toddler. How about a Pastry New Deal? Everyone is in favor of pastry, yes? Donuts, cakes, cookies, pies … we will build hundreds … Thousands of new bakeries … and they will be built by contractors … Jobs! They will be staffed by people and there will be deliveries … Jobs for everyone … pastry for everyone. Happy time! These people … these children sitting on the floor in the photo above … these are embarrassingly dumb toddlers.

  • ericraider33

    Glad that Bob brought up the “leakage” point. Any big push to use green energy will cause overall energy supply to go up. More supply, of course, causes prices to drop, for both green and carbon energy. This will not only spur more usage in India and China, but also in energy intensive industries within the US, like the Airline Industry. So their stated goal of lowering carbon emissions, will be largely overridden by leakage, even within the US (no electric planes on the horizon).

    This specific plan will go nowhere, just like the cap-and-trade junk during Obama’s reign. But, it is important to flatten these idiotic proposals, because they will continue to surface.